More on Pim (2)

Brishen sent this article over from The Idependent, dated April 14th, which has some quotes:

‘The Netherlands is not an immigration country,’ he tells his audience. ‘The annual stream of tens of thousands of newcomers, who largely end up as illegal aliens, must stop. Full is full. We’re living on a small piece of land here.’

All fine and well – if your country is full, a change in immigration policy may be in order. But what will you do to compensate? Will you up foreign aid? Promote education in the places people are attempting to emigrate from?

‘Christianity and Judaism have gone through the laundromat of humanism and enlightenment, but that is not the case with Islam. Modern society places an emphasis on individual responsibility, whereas Islam places an emphasis on collective responsibility and the family. We have a separation of State and Church. The laws of the country are not subject to the Koran. We have equality of men and women in Western society, whereas in Islamic culture women are inferior to men.’

He’s confusing Islam with fundamental islam. In the US, there are plenty of Christians and Jews who firmly believe that homosexuality is wrong, that women are inferior to men, etc. He himself is roman catholic, that does not tolerate homosexuality, nor allow women into the clergy, which would indicate that they believe women are inferior.

Bylhout praises Fortuyn for daring to say that 99 per cent of street crime in Rotterdam is committed by Moroccans and other immigrants. And she fiercely rejects the suggestion that she is being used to soften her boss’s anti- immigrant message. ‘We get so tired of the foreign media saying it [the inclusion of coloured candidates] is a big publicity stunt. I’m Dutch and coloured and I know what I’ve got myself into. I’m working for a better multicultural society.’

This may indeed be true. But is this a product of the ‘nature’ of Moroccans or rather the situation they are forced into in Holland? It is held as true that black men are reponsible for the majority of crime in the US. At the same time, they make up the poorest and most marginalised segments of the US. (Petty) Crime is a product of circumstance, I believe, not nature. Perhaps a policy of social assistance will change that statistic, whereas simply not allowing further Moroccans into Holland will not.

8 Replies to “More on Pim (2)”

  1. Wasn’t Fortuyne saying that just allowsing more and more Moroccans etc. etc. into the Netherlands – even with exemplary social policies – was creating huge problems? What is it about that which is not addressing the circumstances which lead to problem behaviour?

  2. Wasn’t Fortuyne saying that just allowsing more and more Moroccans etc. etc. into the Netherlands – even with exemplary social policies – was creating huge problems? What is it about that which is not addressing the circumstances which lead to problem behaviour?

  3. I think there’s a world of difference between saying ‘many illegal aliens and/or immigrants are forced to turn to crime because our nation doesn’t have any means to provide for them’ vs. saying ‘99% of crime is caused by Moroccans’. As I said above – in a nation such as Holland, it may make perfect sense to stringently limit immigration. What does not make sense is to lay blame for problems on specific ethnic groups. I also believe that simply curbing immigration will not stop the current problems. Are they going to start deporting people? Perhaps. But those who stay still need to be integrated into society (but not necessarily assimilated, another thing Fortuyn seemed to want).

  4. I think there’s a world of difference between saying ‘many illegal aliens and/or immigrants are forced to turn to crime because our nation doesn’t have any means to provide for them’ vs. saying ‘99% of crime is caused by Moroccans’. As I said above – in a nation such as Holland, it may make perfect sense to stringently limit immigration. What does not make sense is to lay blame for problems on specific ethnic groups. I also believe that simply curbing immigration will not stop the current problems. Are they going to start deporting people? Perhaps. But those who stay still need to be integrated into society (but not necessarily assimilated, another thing Fortuyn seemed to want).

  5. There is a world of difference. The first statement makes two claims. One, that immigrants are disproportionatly involved in crime, and two, the reason is because Holland doesn’t have the means to provide for them. The second statement does not make any assumption about the cause of the problem.

    How can a serious investigation into why immigrants turn to crime begin, if the cause is assumed from the outset?

  6. There is a world of difference. The first statement makes two claims. One, that immigrants are disproportionatly involved in crime, and two, the reason is because Holland doesn’t have the means to provide for them. The second statement does not make any assumption about the cause of the problem.

    How can a serious investigation into why immigrants turn to crime begin, if the cause is assumed from the outset?

  7. You’re right, Brahm – I took the first statement too far. My point, lost somewhere in there, was that blaming crime on a particular ethnic group is never a useful tool, in my opinion – it is a divisive tactic, which doesn’t lead to inclusive solutions.

  8. You’re right, Brahm – I took the first statement too far. My point, lost somewhere in there, was that blaming crime on a particular ethnic group is never a useful tool, in my opinion – it is a divisive tactic, which doesn’t lead to inclusive solutions.

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